Новичковые вопросы 7ed WH40k

[Кофермент]

А кстати. выдают ли гравы -1 доп хп за иммобиль по иммобильнутой технике? Это же не бросок по таблице пробивающего попадания. Я полагал, что нет, но играл против колобков не стал спорить, на д2 прокинули, и решилось что дает как утверждал оппонент, а сейчас вот вспомнилось.

Должны наносить исходя из общих соображений.

Поправьте меня если я не прав...

[fpv]

Если написано что чтото порадает по фиксированному значению, значит оно так и попадает, не используя при этом бс или вс. Так что тот же кхарн будет бить кулексуса с вс1 и попадать при этом на 2+.

Для WS - да. А вот для BS - в правилах снапшота есть "In addition, any shooting attack that does not use Ballistic Skill cannot be ‘fired’ as a Snap Shot."

[EasyRider]

Когда чаптер мастер в команднике бросает кому-то челендж, то продолжает ли он пользоваться в челендже ФНП от аптекария? Вроде ничто не мешает, но на всяк случай спрошу...

[samurai_klim]

Запретов нет.

[Grakh]

Всем привет. Заранее спасибо.

1. Можно ли кидать инвуль от 6ок на стомпах?

2. Гарганты двигаются на 12" и у них Мув тру. Сколько кубов кидать при движении через диф?

[Tevet]

Всем привет. Заранее спасибо.

1. Можно ли кидать инвуль от 6ок на стомпах?

Нет, какие сейвы, когда модели просто убираются со стола мимо механики хит-вунд-сейв.

А вообще в любой теме внизу есть поле ввода для поиска внутри темы по ключевым словам, очень удобная вещь, этот вопрос поднимался и не раз вроде бы..

"тырк"

Изменено 2 октября, 2015 пользователем Tevet

[Enthar]

2. Гарганты двигаются на 12" и у них Мув тру. Сколько кубов кидать при движении через диф?

Читаем фак от января 15го года http://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PD...00_Rules_EN.pdf

[Tevet]

Читаем фак от января 15го года http://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PD...00_Rules_EN.pdf

А вот кстати как в раздел факов попасть по-человечески на сайте гв?

[Fatno]

А вот кстати как в раздел факов попасть по-человечески на сайте гв?

В самом низу страницы раздел "Here to Help". Там Rules Errata.

---

upd: Не все ФАКи там актуальны. Часть факов на сайте Black Library актуальнее.

Изменено 17 октября, 2015 пользователем Fatno

[Диваныч]

А вот кстати как в раздел факов попасть по-человечески на сайте гв?

Еще вариант в поиск по сайту вбивать Errata, сразу туда пересылает

[1199fox]

Сегодня возник спор о том из скольких стволов может стрелять гаргант, в правилах самого гарганта написано:

Gargantuan Creatures are Monstrous Creatures that have the additional rules and exceptions given below.

и ниже правило стрельбы:

When a Gargantuan Creature or Flying Gargantuan Creature makes a shooting attack, it may fire each of its weapons at a different target if desired.

То есть как указано что стрельба из каждого оружия в разные цели, но в ответ приводят правило монстры:

Monstrous Creatures can fire up to two of their weapons each Shooting phase - they must, of course, fire both of them at the same target.

и пытаются доказать что гаргант тоже должен стрелять только из двух стволов, что не логично так как у самого гарганта в правиле стрельбы ничего такого нет.

В общем в недоумении как правильно стреляют гарганты из всех стволов или только из двух?

[Келл]

Сегодня возник спор...

Gargantuan Creatures are Monstrous Creatures...

Monstrous Creatures can fire up to two of their weapons

Все ясно и четко расписано - два оружия в фазу стрельбы. Просто любое из этих двух оружий может быть направлено в другую цель.

Впрочем, вы всегда можете поучаствовать в 9 страницах срача на эту тему вот здесь:

"Ссылка"

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/240/646574.page

Изменено 2 октября, 2015 пользователем sky_kell

[Frees]

When a Gargantuan Creature ... makes a shooting attack, it may fire each of its weapons at a different target if desired.

Собственно вот тут написано то каждым стволом (а их может быть много) в другую цель, если захочет.

[Logan03]

Где можно посмотреть правила на Кархародонов ? И вообще ордена которых нет в обычных кодексах 30 к

[Locke]

ИА про Бадаб, форджовые апдейты к нему с чаптертактиками.

[Маннергем]

Вопрос: Какие леталки можно взять Кровавым Ангелам? В кодексе есть ШтормРейвен, в ИА2 - разные ШтормИглы, Цестус..Но они..Дороговаты по птс, хочется что-то менее мультизадачное (тут и транспорт, и ассолтный, и пострелять, и броня куда ни шло), и более дешевое от этого. Как ванильный ШтормТалон, кусочек стрелковой радости за копейки практически.

Собственно, может я пропустил какой-то еще источник, где можно поискать леталку?

А если нет - ИА-шные ледспидеры, Джавелин и Темпест, как они вообще, имеют хоть какой-то потенциал?

[Domin]

Очередной "новичковый вопрос":

Есть такой тип техники, как Chariot. Правила сразу положу сюда под спойлер, чтобы не возникало сомнений о недомолвках.

"цитата"

CHARIOTS

Some Chariots are personal war machines for characters that prefer to lead their forces to battle from a suitably grandiose perch; others are brutal constructions designed for little purpose other than to crush their enemies beneath wickedly spiked wheels. A Chariot is an unusual unit with a dual profile – a non-vehicle profile for the rider of the Chariot (see below), and a vehicle profile for the Chariot itself. However, a Chariot is always treated as a single model. For the purposes of characteristics tests, always use the rider’s profile. Furthermore, any characteristics modifiers that affect a Chariot model apply to both rider and Chariot.

CHARACTERS RIDING CHARIOTS

A character mounted on a Chariot is referred to as the rider. A rider cannot disembark from his Chariot, nor can he be targeted separately from his Chariot. If either the rider is reduced to 0 Wounds or his Chariot is destroyed, then the entire model is removed from play as a casualty. If the rider has a special rule that returns it to play after it has been removed as a casualty, such as a Necron’s Ever-living special rule, that model’s Chariot is also returned to play with a single Hull Point.

MOVING CHARIOTS

Chariots move normally for a vehicle of their type.

SHOOTING WITH CHARIOTS

When determining the required To Hit roll for any weapons fired by a Chariot model, use the Ballistic Skill on the Chariot’s profile for any weapons mounted on the Chariot itself, and the Ballistic Skill on the rider’s profile for any weapons wielded by the rider. In addition to the Chariot’s weapons shooting, the rider can shoot any shooting weapon he himself is equipped with, counting as stationary even if the Chariot moved in the previous Movement phase – the Chariot and rider must target the same unit though.

SHOOTING AT CHARIOTS

When shooting at a Chariot unit, total up the number of successful hits that have been caused. Keep the dice that have scored hits and create a ‘pool’, where each dice represents a hit. If there are hits with different Strengths, AP values or special rules that affect saving throws or any Wounds they inflict, split them into several pools of hits. All hits with exactly the same Strength, AP value and special rules must go into the same pool. If all the hits are the same, there will be only one hit pool. The player controlling the Chariot unit then allocates each hit pool either to the rider or the Chariot of the closest model in the unit. If several pools of hits need to be allocated, the player making the attacks must decide in which order they are resolved. All hits from a single pool must be allocated and resolved before moving on to the next pool of hits. Hit pools from Blast and Template weapons are always resolved against the Chariot. If the Chariot model is hit by a Precision Shot, that hit is allocated by the firer, not the owning player.

When resolving successful hits that have been assigned to a Chariot, work out which of its Armour Values to use as you would for any other vehicle, based on the position of the model compared to the model firing at it.

CHARIOTS AND ASSAULTS

Unlike other vehicles, Chariots can make charge moves and can be locked in combat. Chariots can only declare a charge in the Assault phase if they did not move Flat Out in the Shooting phase. Chariots charge like Bikes. Chariots that charge through difficult terrain must take a Dangerous Terrain test (unless they are Skimmers). Chariots that are Skimmers must take a Dangerous Terrain test if they begin or end their charge move in difficult terrain. A Chariot that fails a Dangerous Terrain test suffers a glancing hit. As long as the charge range is sufficient to bring the hull (or base) into contact with the target unit, the charge is successful.

Fighting From a Chariot

In close combat, Chariots fight like Infantry models. Chariots may make Sweeping Advances, Pile In moves and Consolidations unless they are Stunned.

Fighting Against a Chariot

When fighting against a Chariot model, the attacker must decide whether to attack the rider or the Chariot with each model involved in the combat. All of the close combat attacks from each model must be resolved against the nominated target (i.e. the attacks cannot be split between the rider and the Chariot) – even if the Chariot model is subsequently hit by a Precision Strike.

In either case, always roll To Hit against the rider’s Weapon Skill, then resolve any damage against the nominated target as normal. Grenades can only be used to attack the Chariot, so cannot be used by models that choose to target the rider.

Any hits assigned to the Chariot roll for armour penetration against its front armour. This is because, unlike with other vehicles, the Chariot’s rider can defend it. Similarly, damage results that do not destroy a Chariot do not affect the way its rider fights in close combat.

Challenges

A rider who is a character can issue or accept a challenge as normal, but cannot perform a Glorious Intervention.

CREW & BEASTS

In addition to the rider, some Chariots have crew or are pulled into battle by beasts. Any crew or beasts that pull a Chariot are ignored and can never be targeted separately from the vehicle. Furthermore, a Chariot’s crew or beasts cannot attack unless otherwise stated in the Chariot’s profile or special rules.

Hammer of Wrath (for Chariots)

If a Chariot ends its charge move in base or hull contact with one or more enemy models, it makes D6 additional attacks that hit automatically and are resolved at Strength 6 AP - (unless otherwise stated). These attacks do not benefit from any of the Chariot’s (or rider’s) special rules (such as Furious Charge, Rending etc.). These attacks are resolved during the Fight sub-phase at the Initiative 10 step, but does not grant the Chariot an additional Pile In move at the Initiative 10 step.

If a Chariot charges a building or a vehicle that is a Transport or Chariot, the Hammer of Wrath hits are resolved against the building or vehicle, not the occupants or rider.

RIDERLESS CHARIOTS

Very occasionally a Chariot will not have a rider. In this case, all attacks that hit the model must be allocated to the Chariot itself. In close combat, a riderless Chariot will make its Hammer of Wrath hits as normal, but will not make any further attacks and is hit by enemy models as for other vehicles (i.e. it is treated as having Weapon Skill 1).

CHARIOTS AND IMMOBILISED RESULTS

Chariots count Immobilised results from the Vehicle Damage table as a Crew Stunned result instead. A Chariot will still need to take a Dangerous Terrain test if it moves through difficult terrain. However, if this test is failed, the Chariot is not Immobilised – instead, it suffers a glancing hit.

SPECIAL RULES

A Chariot has the Hammer of Wrath special rule, but gains D6 attacks rather than one, resolved at Strength 6 AP-, unless otherwise stated. A Chariot can re-roll one or more of the dice when determining its charge range.

A rider has the Fearless and Relentless special rules. A rider can fire Overwatch if its Chariot is charged, but it cannot shoot any of the weapons mounted on the Chariot itself.

Вопрос - поскольку Chariot не является Transport (по крайней мере в кодексе демонов ни один из них транспортом не является, и даже Transport Capacity им факом убрали) - соответственно, правила транспорта на него не распространяются - что мне мешает проехать чариоткой на 12, пострелять райдером из своего оружия и потом/предварительно чариоткой еще и пофлетаутить? Дискасс.

P.S. Очень прошу аргументировать в рамках RAW.

[7ers]

"цитата"

CHARIOTS

Some Chariots are personal war machines for characters that prefer to lead their forces to battle from a suitably grandiose perch; others are brutal constructions designed for little purpose other than to crush their enemies beneath wickedly spiked wheels. A Chariot is an unusual unit with a dual profile – a non-vehicle profile for the rider of the Chariot (see below), and a vehicle profile for the Chariot itself. However, a Chariot is always treated as a single model. For the purposes of characteristics tests, always use the rider’s profile. Furthermore, any characteristics modifiers that affect a Chariot model apply to both rider and Chariot.

CHARACTERS RIDING CHARIOTS

A character mounted on a Chariot is referred to as the rider. A rider cannot disembark from his Chariot, nor can he be targeted separately from his Chariot. If either the rider is reduced to 0 Wounds or his Chariot is destroyed, then the entire model is removed from play as a casualty. If the rider has a special rule that returns it to play after it has been removed as a casualty, such as a Necron’s Ever-living special rule, that model’s Chariot is also returned to play with a single Hull Point.

MOVING CHARIOTS

Chariots move normally for a vehicle of their type.

SHOOTING WITH CHARIOTS

When determining the required To Hit roll for any weapons fired by a Chariot model, use the Ballistic Skill on the Chariot’s profile for any weapons mounted on the Chariot itself, and the Ballistic Skill on the rider’s profile for any weapons wielded by the rider. In addition to the Chariot’s weapons shooting, the rider can shoot any shooting weapon he himself is equipped with, counting as stationary even if the Chariot moved in the previous Movement phase – the Chariot and rider must target the same unit though.

SHOOTING AT CHARIOTS

When shooting at a Chariot unit, total up the number of successful hits that have been caused. Keep the dice that have scored hits and create a ‘pool’, where each dice represents a hit. If there are hits with different Strengths, AP values or special rules that affect saving throws or any Wounds they inflict, split them into several pools of hits. All hits with exactly the same Strength, AP value and special rules must go into the same pool. If all the hits are the same, there will be only one hit pool. The player controlling the Chariot unit then allocates each hit pool either to the rider or the Chariot of the closest model in the unit. If several pools of hits need to be allocated, the player making the attacks must decide in which order they are resolved. All hits from a single pool must be allocated and resolved before moving on to the next pool of hits. Hit pools from Blast and Template weapons are always resolved against the Chariot. If the Chariot model is hit by a Precision Shot, that hit is allocated by the firer, not the owning player.

When resolving successful hits that have been assigned to a Chariot, work out which of its Armour Values to use as you would for any other vehicle, based on the position of the model compared to the model firing at it.

CHARIOTS AND ASSAULTS

Unlike other vehicles, Chariots can make charge moves and can be locked in combat. Chariots can only declare a charge in the Assault phase if they did not move Flat Out in the Shooting phase. Chariots charge like Bikes. Chariots that charge through difficult terrain must take a Dangerous Terrain test (unless they are Skimmers). Chariots that are Skimmers must take a Dangerous Terrain test if they begin or end their charge move in difficult terrain. A Chariot that fails a Dangerous Terrain test suffers a glancing hit. As long as the charge range is sufficient to bring the hull (or base) into contact with the target unit, the charge is successful.

Fighting From a Chariot

In close combat, Chariots fight like Infantry models. Chariots may make Sweeping Advances, Pile In moves and Consolidations unless they are Stunned.

Fighting Against a Chariot

When fighting against a Chariot model, the attacker must decide whether to attack the rider or the Chariot with each model involved in the combat. All of the close combat attacks from each model must be resolved against the nominated target (i.e. the attacks cannot be split between the rider and the Chariot) – even if the Chariot model is subsequently hit by a Precision Strike.

In either case, always roll To Hit against the rider’s Weapon Skill, then resolve any damage against the nominated target as normal. Grenades can only be used to attack the Chariot, so cannot be used by models that choose to target the rider.

Any hits assigned to the Chariot roll for armour penetration against its front armour. This is because, unlike with other vehicles, the Chariot’s rider can defend it. Similarly, damage results that do not destroy a Chariot do not affect the way its rider fights in close combat.

Challenges

A rider who is a character can issue or accept a challenge as normal, but cannot perform a Glorious Intervention.

CREW & BEASTS

In addition to the rider, some Chariots have crew or are pulled into battle by beasts. Any crew or beasts that pull a Chariot are ignored and can never be targeted separately from the vehicle. Furthermore, a Chariot’s crew or beasts cannot attack unless otherwise stated in the Chariot’s profile or special rules.

Hammer of Wrath (for Chariots)

If a Chariot ends its charge move in base or hull contact with one or more enemy models, it makes D6 additional attacks that hit automatically and are resolved at Strength 6 AP - (unless otherwise stated). These attacks do not benefit from any of the Chariot’s (or rider’s) special rules (such as Furious Charge, Rending etc.). These attacks are resolved during the Fight sub-phase at the Initiative 10 step, but does not grant the Chariot an additional Pile In move at the Initiative 10 step.

If a Chariot charges a building or a vehicle that is a Transport or Chariot, the Hammer of Wrath hits are resolved against the building or vehicle, not the occupants or rider.

RIDERLESS CHARIOTS

Very occasionally a Chariot will not have a rider. In this case, all attacks that hit the model must be allocated to the Chariot itself. In close combat, a riderless Chariot will make its Hammer of Wrath hits as normal, but will not make any further attacks and is hit by enemy models as for other vehicles (i.e. it is treated as having Weapon Skill 1).

CHARIOTS AND IMMOBILISED RESULTS

Chariots count Immobilised results from the Vehicle Damage table as a Crew Stunned result instead. A Chariot will still need to take a Dangerous Terrain test if it moves through difficult terrain. However, if this test is failed, the Chariot is not Immobilised – instead, it suffers a glancing hit.

SPECIAL RULES

A Chariot has the Hammer of Wrath special rule, but gains D6 attacks rather than one, resolved at Strength 6 AP-, unless otherwise stated. A Chariot can re-roll one or more of the dice when determining its charge range.

A rider has the Fearless and Relentless special rules. A rider can fire Overwatch if its Chariot is charged, but it cannot shoot any of the weapons mounted on the Chariot itself.

P.S. Очень прошу аргументировать в рамках RAW.

Советую ознакомиться с демонским факом

Стоп, не так вопрос прочитал.

Изменено 5 октября, 2015 пользователем 7ers

[Enthar]

Чариотка и наездник считаются как одна модель. Стрелял наездник - стреляла модель. Модель является вайхикал - вайхикал не может флетаутить после стрельбы.

[Domin]

Чариотка и наездник считаются как одна модель. Стрелял наездник - стреляла модель. Модель является вайхикал - вайхикал не может флетаутить после стрельбы.

Интересная точка зрения, но меня смущает следующий момент. Стрельба самой чариотки и ее райдера идет параллельно, единственное ограничение - если оба стреляют, то должны выбирать одну цель. Точно так же, как правила чариотки

(приснопамятный джинк) не дают преимуществ райдеру, хотя они и считаются как одна модель.

Изменено 5 октября, 2015 пользователем Domin

[SmallEvilman]

Модель стреляла? - да

Флэт аут вместо стрельбы? - да

Еще вопросы :rolleyes:

Изменено 5 октября, 2015 пользователем SmallEvilman

[Domin]

Модель стреляла? - да

Еще вопросы :rolleyes:

Вопрос - почему тогда если модель джинкует, у райдера нет 4+ ковра?)

[SmallEvilman]

Вопрос - почему тогда если модель джинкует, у райдера нет 4+ ковра?)

мб потому что у них 2 профля и не прописано что спец рулы шарятся :rolleyes:

[Domin]

мб потому что у них 2 профля и не прописано что спец рулы шарятся :rolleyes:

Но ведь одна модель же?) На которую, по вордингу, действует джинк. Так что или трусы оденьте, или крестик снимите.

По мне, так разделять надо - rider, который infantry (character) и chariot, который chariot, skimmer, fast.

[SmallEvilman]

Но ведь одна модель же?) На которую, по вордингу, действует джинк. Так что или трусы оденьте, или крестик снимите.

По мне, так разделять надо - rider, который infantry (character) и chariot, который chariot, skimmer, fast.

джинк действует на всю модель, но от этого у райдера спец правила джинк не появляется, ага :rolleyes: